Optical sizes for logos?

[jabez]

Here's another example:

A major drawback of the original logo was that its fine details made it hard to reproduce in smaller sizes. In an effort to remedy this problem, Hayman devised three marks: a highly detailed version for larger uses, a simplified version for smaller print pieces, and a logotype-only version for especially small applications such as book and CD spines.

http://pentagram.com/en/new/2009/01/new-work-white-house-historica-1.php

[dtw]

@Jeff: re "Do you know why they allow the logo to be printed that small?"

Most publishers will want some version of their logo to go on spines. The big version's OK for an inch-thick textbook, but Palgrave publish journals too. Consider the thickness of a 64-page issue. (About 4mm, as it happens.)

LOL re that tiny version you typed. Find a font with an 8-pointed asterisk (I know I've seen a few) and that might be good idea!

[edit: Unicode 2733 ... ✳]
________________________________________________
Ever since I chose to block pop-ups, my toaster's stopped working.

[dberlowgone]

>“the concept is nice, but do not go there”

Ooops.;) we do it all the time, have for several decades. Size masters for a logo depends on the logo and the user, and their concern for clarity. We've done versions for size, for color, for resolution and for device.

Cheers!

[nina]

"I don’t know how the company you are designing for works"
I'm beginning to realize how lucky I am with my client in this case:
1) They're a very small company (less than ten people).
2) They're in a design/media related field, so they have (a) good eyes and (b) respect for design (and (c) are well aware of cross-media/resolution issues & such).
3) They love the logo.
That said, I can see how in most/many cases the optical sizing thing wouldn't be very practicable. I've gotten enough 72k GIFs as logos to print on posters myself…

[nina]

David, interesting! What does "for device" entail, assuming that it's separate from the resolution question?

[Frode Bo Helland]

The Typecon logo (system) reduse the number of lines at small sizes.

[Joe Pemberton]

Handpicked, hand tweeted. http://twitter.com/Typophile/status/3437414477

[Dunwich Type]

For the last logo I did I provided two optical sizes and a special version for use in long, tight spaces (with DVD and CD spines in mind). The logo was done for a small business, so I felt pretty safe thinking that the owner would keep the variations in mind, and he has.

[hbeier]

The best case I know is the Lloyd's logo. They've got 3 versions of their symbol for different sizes/production processes. You can take a look at their brand guidelines on their website and clicking on the first PDF link. To be even more specific, the different versions are described on page 20.

I hope it helps.

Henrique

[CreativeNRG]

@hbeler: Thanks for the excellent example.

Out of curiosity I animated the small-size version of their 'Arms' logo with the standard-size version. It illustrates pretty well why optimizing certain logos has it merit and my once hard line perspective has forever been changed.

[dberlowgone]

Frode is correct, and we also have encountered problems with complexity of contours that will not work on some devices.

Cheers!

[dinazina]

The poplular Elliott Bay Brewery Pub in Seattle has an elaborate sign:

Which is somewhat simplified for print purposes:

And further simplified as a small mark for use on napkins, website, etc.

[Miss Tiffany]

Back in the 90s when Novell first began they had a logo with optical sizes. I'm having déjà vu, I swear I wrote this already.

They had a logo with prongs on it. And the number of prongs was dependent upon the size of the logo. Building size had more prongs that back of package address size.

[russellm]

@ Don, One example is the IBM logo. The number of bars changes when used very small or very large.

Can you point to some examples of this?

Thanks

-=®=-

[Bendy]

Here's one more I just came across:
Investors in People UK

Following this thread, I've actually got our design agency to provide two versions of our company logo:

The small size versions (right side) have INTERNATIONAL in a heavier weight, no (R) mark, and the monochrome version has less detail in the flower element. Thanks Nina for the useful thread! :D

[Maxim Zhukov]

The logo for the ATypI conference of 2008 was created in three scale-optimised versions:

[Tomi from Suomi]

I've tried to make logos to work in all sizes. More work making it, but less in implementing.

[Maxim Zhukov]

There is no way the same artwork can do for a 5-metre-high sign perched on top of a building, silk-screened on fabric, posted on a Web site, used as a favicon on the browser navigation bar, or printed on a business card. It’s obvious that you have to optimize the design—among other things, for size.

[Bendy]

>I've tried to make logos to work in all sizes. More work making it, but less in implementing.

If you can do that, great. But I think especially with a logotype the characters need beefing up for tiny sizes. And isn't it more work to create different versions of the logo rather than less?

[J.Montalbano]

We recently redrew the Barneys New York logo and provided them with two versions.

[ill sans]

One example that immediately comes to mind is the Fortis logo. There are two different versions (one with 23 shapes & one with 32 shapes; if I remember correctly, I didn't bother to count).

Getting your client to follow the guidelines might be a bit tricky though. I didn't even realise there were 2 different versions of this logo untill after working with it regularly for a couple of years, I finally got the guideline from one of their banks.

[Jennifer E. Dahl]

[serpt99]

There is no way the same artwork can do for a 5-metre-high sign perched on top of a building, silk-screened on fabric, posted on a Web site, used as a favicon on the browser navigation bar, or printed on a business card. It’s obvious that you have to optimize the design—among other things, for size.

[Nick Shinn]

If it is not already possible, we are on the cusp of being able to put a colored logo into a font, and specify versions for rendering at specific sizes. This will be great for zooming on devices.

[nina]

Apropos:
http://responsivelogos.co.uk/