Two New Trends in Arabic Typography

[Member Vla…]

This topic was imported from the Typophile platform

There are two new trends in Arabic typography that need to be critically discussed by the designer and user community.

One trend is Huda Smitshuijzen AbiFares' Typographic Matchmaking effort (www.khtt.net) where Arab type designers have been paired with master designers of Latin type to produce Arabic fonts that match the Latin in style. I feel the experience of working with master designers cannot but have a positive impact on the technical quality of any resulting type. On the other hand there is the inherent danger that the resulting Arabic glyphs are constrained in style and proportion to match the x height of the Latin. What is the best way for two fonts of very different languages to appear harmoniously on the same page?

Another important trend, Tasmeem, is a plug-in to Adobe's Middle East version of InDesign released by Winsoft www.winsoft-international.com . This is the result of years of research and effort by Tom Milo and his team at Decotype www.decotype.com. Here the software automatically manipulates the placement of a small number of component glyphs to produce type for the full range of Arabic and related languages, allowing the precise control of spacing, the choice of glyph variants, and the exact placements of dots and vowels. Tasmeem was originally conceived to display traditional calligraphic styles. How will the software work with newer more geometrical styles of Arabic?

I have drawn the following cartoon to show my personal take on these efforts, which are both based in Holland. The Matchmakers are to the left, while Tasmeem operations take place in the center. A larger-resolution open-license image is also attached.

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[Member hra…]

Sadly, I agree with your cartoon!

hhp

[Member Tho…]

Sad indeed. An threatening. Imperialism appears to have taken a new guise :-)

First the grazhdanskaya tipografiya or civil type is developed for the Russians - by the Dutch. Helvetica to this day is under threat of - yes, Dutch type. And now aa alarming tsunami of Dutch design is hitting the Arab world. Whose script will be the next victim? Armenian? Japanese?

Let's stop this nonsense and begin with retuning Latin script to the Romans and Greek to the Phoenicians.

Good riddens. And good bye to world civilization.

Thomas Milo
DecoType
www.decotype.com

[Member Tho…]

BTW, Vladimir: Tasmeem is a new trend in font technology - and an old one at the same time, because the underlying ACE engine has been around for quite a while and was Microsoft's proof-of-concept for was later to become Open Type.

Tasmeem is totally transparent regarding Arabic typography, so one cannot seriously raise a debate about Tasmeem relative to "matchmaking". Tasmeem can handle such typography just as well as any other approach to Arabic script.

The real trends are Design vs. Modelling of Arabic script. Modeling was the original business of all typographers, design is by now a no longer new secondary approach to Arabic typography. Computer Modelling however is technically speaking new, it attempts to document, analyse and synthesize classic styles and typfaces and make them available as Arabic typography.

ACE is very suitable for Computer Modelling, whereas OpenType is less useful for this approach. Yet is has been attempted at least once, as can be seen in the MS Arabic typesetting font. I believe Diwan's Mushafi font is also an OpenType computer model. On the other hand there s nothing in matchmaking to date that ACE couldn't handle. In fact, our new template approach to Tasmeem Font Design will make life of matchmakers, too, a lot easier. After all, the graphic template is supported by an invisible logic and unicode template. Your own Al Quds Tasmeemi - a good example of matchmaking - displays the famous Afghani Rahman Baba poem perfectly - in Pashto.

Summarizing: Tasmeem and Matchmaking ar not playing in the same league, a comparison is a non-starter. They are not at odds with each other. Nor are Design vs Modelling. They exist side by side.

Regards,

Thomas Milo
DecoType
www.decotype.com

[Member Azi…]

Sadly Arabs are still looking West by coming into houses (of AC+AT) from their rear windows, whereas their doors open East?!

[Member Tho…]

Through Eastern doors boatloads of Japanese cars come to the Arabs. Through western windows downloads of software come to the Arabs. All main computer platforms are American, along with the domination of simplified computer Arabic. Typographers today, including designers for Arabic, work with Russian tools. French arabize the Creative Suite. Bulgarians and Romanians once manufactured Korans on a large scale. Hungarians and Armenians created the Arabic typography that made it work for the Middle east. Persians wrote the grammar of Classical Arabic. Italians translated it. Germans study it. There's nothing sad about all this. These are all fascinating aspects of world civilization, of which the Arabs are part and parcel.

Thomas Milo
DecoType
www.decotype.com

[Member beh…]

I'm all with you on this Tom.
I like to see a total separation between design options and technical matters. And I like to see technical matters don't stand on the way of design, the way they always did.
Although I think that matchmaking is a terribly terribly awful idea, but I don't want to see technical matters stand on its way. The question is why nobody thought of matching Roman script to Arabic?!
I only hope that your project expands in the real world in a tangible way.
Good luck,

Behnam

[Member Azi…]

Thomas Milo + Behnam

There’s nothing sad about all this (to non-Arab). These are all fascinating aspects of world civilization, of which the Arabs are (not) part and parcel.

All that because Arabs consigned the God-Sent Glorious Quran to oblivion.

[Member beh…]

People don't speak Quran. They speak a language.

[Member Azi…]

Had God made it a non-Arabic Qur'an, they would have surely said,
"Why have not its signs been articulated?"
" What! A non-Arabian scripture [and an Arabian] prophet]!?"
Say," For those who have faith, it is a guidance and healing;
but as for those who are faithless, there is a deafness in their ears
and it is lost to their sight."
They are as if they were called from a distant place.

[Member Saa…]

Behnam wrote:

>>The question is why nobody thought of matching Roman script to Arabic?!

Look around there are tons of those. In Latin users have so many choices, Arabic users should too. The way to do it is to *believe* in users (not to speak on their behalf) and keep options *wide* open. This openness was the reason behind the golden days for Arabic, but we should not keep rehearsing past successes only but also make new advances and learn past lessons. Making fixed design rules or allowing only limited fixed flavors, would eventually destroy the Arabic script.

While I do not think we should forbid matchmaking or even criticize it, I personally do not think matchmaking would be the ideal or significant way to advance Arabic typography. I do not see value for Arabic in fixed x-heights, for example. I believe designers should look to the rich history of Arabic shapes for innovation, and understand the rich lessons of typography as a field, Latin, or else, to apply in Arabic. Arabic type designers' heroes need not be necessarily those of Latin typography, but those of Arabic typography and calligraphy.

I see Tom Milo's work as a significant breakthrough. Over the years, his dedication had made him "shaykh al-Musammimeen". Still, I had never seen the value of his work as being the right or the wrong typography. I see it as a great Arabic typography work. He is therefore a real Arabic typography hero.

Matchmaking is OK as long as it is not presented as the way Arabic typography "should" be. It is ok as long as it is not turned into a vehicle to exercise censorship and disrespect to others, or to use as a way to promote personal resumes by coupling up with shiny Latin Typography names! What was disturbing in that project was not the project itself, but the fact it was coupled with comments to "redicule" great Arbabic typography works like that of Decotype.

-Saad

[Member Saa…]

Vladimir

I love your cartoon. Again, a man of a million talents!

>>What is the best way for two fonts of very different languages to appear harmoniously on the same page?

The best way is to think about Latin/Arabic harmony as an isolated and limited task for a specific font, and to get on with designing *Arabetic* fonts without harmony with Latin in mind!

>>Tasmeem was originally conceived to display traditional calligraphic styles. How will the software work with newer more geometrical styles of Arabic?

The main problem of Tasmeem is it current high intimidating learning and production curve. The closer a designer of Opentype can design Tasmeem fonts as if desining an OpenType, the better Tasmeem will work for Arabic.

-Saad

[Member Saa…]

AzizMostafa wrote:

>>All that because Arabs consigned the God-Sent Glorious Quran to oblivion.

Oh, no. The Arabs have kept their Quran ok, but without a drop of shame they have *unnecessarily* trashed their Arabic language to the lowest level, may god never forgive them for that!

In Dubei, Dohah, Riyad,...etc, they have done to Arabic what even Lebanon did not dare to it, with all its empty Ramonce with French. In the Persian Gulf, they write "shareehat Samak" (شريحة سمك), "fish fillet" in Arabic font like this "فش فيللت" Or they write "Maqtu'ah Musiqiah" (مقطوعة موسيقية), "Clip" and wite it in Arabic font like this: "كليب"

I rather write English language words in English letters, loosers! In a good melting pot culture like that of Baghdad 1000 years ago, not Dubai now a day, non Arabs came in and became heroes of Arabic in addition to keeping aspects of their culture. A new rich culture was born. In the westernized fake societies of the Middle East today, all cultures are trashed, the hosting and the visiting ones. Following the words of Quraan while trashing the Arabic language can not go together!

-Saad

[Member nad…]

Dear Vladimir,
It's a very interesting point that you raise though I disagree with the premise of the argument. I find that in the recent period there has been a needless politicizing of Arabic typography in which projects are labeled as either a Huda or a Thomas approach. This is problematic to the field and I truly believe that we should snap out of this mind set.

It is true that there are new trends emerging in Arabic type design and though they might fall along the lines you describe, there are other ways to look at this.

Some designers are more interested in the resulting visual aesthetic (for example, an Arabic companion to a famous Latin typeface) and there are those who are interested in investigating the complex structural aspects of the script (and that's where Tasmeem sits). In the first camp, the end result is a product intended for a specific use (a text face, a signage face etc...) while the second camp is an approach to design rather than a product in itself.

This is why I would argue against a split between what you describe as 2 trends. It would be quite feasible to design an Arabic version of a Latin typeface using Tasmeem technology. It is true that in designing an Arabic counterpart to an existing Latin there are a lot of considerations that need to be taken, but it does not necessarily mean that the basic characteristics of the script are being sacrificed.

There's been a lot of publicity regarding the Typographic Matchmaking project and as one of the designers, I can easily say that it's been taken a bit out of context. As far as I know, none of the designers looked at their designs as the "one solution" to the question of Arabic type design. The process of working alongside more experienced type designers and learning from them was the whole point of the exercise, at least for me. It was a great experience and we all benefited.

The Typographic Matchmaking project was not the first, and is not the last, to approach the concept of an Arabic match to existing Latin. It is a legitimate question, not because Arabic needs to follow a Latin, but because of the demands of the market place. This demand exists and the perils of graphic designers taking things into their own hands can be seen in the streets of Dubai where cut-and-paste Latin characters masquerade as Arabic.

In any case, I think we should rejoice in the fact that so many people are interested in exploring new ideas. It's a very exciting period to live in.

[Member k.l…]

I agree with your conclusions. The most important sentence is this:

It would be quite feasible to design an Arabic version of a Latin typeface using Tasmeem technology.

Put differently, TMM could as well have used ACE technology* instead of OT technology. OT layout tables are mere technology, ACE is mere technology, and both can be used for whatever kind of design.
The difference is their architecture and how suited each is for the task at hand (laying out Arabic script). This affects not only elegance of the respective approach but also reduction of complexity -- how easy is it for designers to create fonts of various degrees of complexity. The last aspect is not unimportant. If the reason for typefaces to be kept "simple" is restrictions of the technology, then something went terribly wrong. Technology should be gentle and allow for whatever may make sense. And whether designers prefer simplified or complex designs should be entirely driven by their design visions, not by technology or by their ability or inability to master it. With OpenType, I fear that often it is indeed the latter than determines design.

One tiny correction. In the opposition which you sketch there is a misconception which is also at the heart of the (to me) silly ACE vs TMM debate:

Some designers are more interested in the resulting visual aesthetic (for example, an Arabic companion to a famous Latin typeface) and there are those who are interested in investigating the complex structural aspects of the script (and that's where Tasmeem sits).

This neglects an important point: Analysing the structure of a script (in this case Arabic) is necessary condition for developing technology which in turn serves as vehicle for actual fonts which incorporate this or that design. In so far, Thomas did the ground work on which results others can base their (design) work.
(In this respect, of course not only ACE but also the architecture of OT layout tables is based on analysis of one or more scripts. Which again raises the single relevant question -- which analysis and thus technology is more appropriate?)

Reading Vladimir's original post again, I find that this is in the first place about different approaches to design. The one visible in TMM typefaces and DecoType's which is more traditional. The mentioning of Tasmeem or ACE in this context is a bit misleading because it mixes different levels. Or does the question "How will the software work with newer more geometrical styles of Arabic?" indicate that the design level is independent of the technology level?

* Not "Tasmeem technology". ACE is the technology, Tasmeem makes use of it. Just like OT is the technology of which InDesign makes use. As an analogy, you would not say that Linotype offers "InDesign fonts", I assume.  :)

[Says someone who is ignorant of Arabic but highly interested in technology as Bedingung für die Möglichkeit von design.]

[Member Vla…]

Sadly, I agree with your cartoon!
Hrant, it was supposed to make us laugh! Even at ourselves, as well as to think about Arabic typography.

These are all fascinating aspects of world civilization, of which the Arabs are part and parcel
Exactly, Tom. We are living in an incredible period of history where the fruits of science and technology are available to one and all. Let us not forget the invention of algebra and the adoption of the zero, which are at the heart of computer languages 0000100110. Moslems and Arabs have nothing to be ashamed of in this age that started with Western technical dominance.

Matchmaking is OK as long as it is not presented as the way Arabic typography “should” be
Well, Saad, the khtt website presents it as a turning Point in Arab Typography. Matchmaking is a sound idea only insofar as that two languages on the same page should not appear to compete for attention without reason. Since the mid-sixties the Arab press is favoring the use of Latinized Arab numerals 012345 (rather than the Indic numerals). The fonts often used for the numerals is awfully mismatched and jumps out of the line in a disturbing way. The glory of Arabic script is the compact and curvatious lines and highly developed sense of the individuality of each letter-shape. It is written in a totally different spirit than Latin with its blocks of same-height letters and repeated forms.

It is true that there are new trends emerging in Arabic type design and though they might fall along the lines you describe, there are other ways to look at this.
Indeed, Nadine. You are specially welcome here as it is good to hear the views of someone in a position to know much more about what is going on in the market and design community than any one of us as individuals. The cartoon did not depict the many other significant developments going on in Arabic font design, only to deal with the topical subject of the panel discussion that took place last week in Amsterdam. I hope to learn more about what occurred there.
I should explain a bit more about why I find the Matchmaking vs. Tasmeem so necessary to discuss critically. It has now become technically possible to present scripts of any imaginable complexity by programming the software under the hood. That is what Tom and his Tasmeem team have done so brilliantly for Arabic, and designers and font developers should explore its possibilities not only for calligraphic styles such as Naskh. More about that later.
In contrast my impression is that Huda’s Matchmaking effort holds Latin as the ideal to which Arabic should aspire. This is indeed sad. Doubtless Latin type has had centuries of a head start over Arabic (or Japanese or Telugu) but each script has an essential design philosophy that should be respected even as the shapes adapt to modern techniques and prevailing design fashions. The khtt group has succeeded nicely to encourage young people to take an interest in Arabic typography, and Tasmeem is making headway among printing and publishing professionals. It is high time the two teams in Holland cooperate in some ways to further promote the field as a whole. Arabic typography and font design can only benefit.

The question is why nobody thought of matching Roman script to Arabic?!
Behnam, I have recently designed a Latin font to match in style, stem width and line endings the Arabic of my forthcoming AlQuds font. I am now newly aware how difficult it is to design a really good Latin font!

It would be quite feasible to design an Arabic version of a Latin typeface using Tasmeem technology
Karsten, not only of Latin, insofar as I understand its workings, Tasmeem is an intelligent-font technology that can be adapted to any script.

As Aziz would say, with tulips.

[Member fin…]

Forgive an ignorant student of Arabic and Calligraphy to ask some questions...I know I'm going to say some ignorant things here, and you guys are going to set me in my place. Good. I'm truly asking in order to understand.

Didn't Arabic evolve from the Kufi script that was originally somewhat flat, rigid and rather "Latinesque?" (fixed/blocky) I know Kufi has many styles, but before Islam the Arabic script was very basic, yes? Eventually master calligraphers redefined the original Arabic into incredible art forms, but couldn't it be said that they did this because they were playing with the language and redefining it?

I mean, were the avant garde calligraphers not true to the original Kufi script when they made Nasque, Thuluth or Diwani? They were expanding on the past to meet current trends or regional artistic styles (surely influenced by their own cultural heritage).

This just seems to be the natural course of civilization. What if 1000 years down the road we're trying to cram Latin characters into the next big thing?

Is everybody uptight because we feel like the Arabic script will be lost if we force it into the Latin mold? I think MUCH worse things have happened, such as Saad's lamenting "كليب". Perhaps people are unnecessarily lumping Matchmaking into the same pot?

How is the Matchmaking project any different than what happened in the past? They're meeting a need. Is Tasmeem a sweet idea? Of course. I have the basic Tasmeem myself.

As a designer, I want it all! Not necessarily on the same page, but I still want it all. (But I reserve the right to change my mind.)

[Member Vla…]

Didn’t Arabic evolve from the Kufi script that was originally somewhat flat, rigid and rather “Latinesque?” (fixed/blocky)
You make a good point. Square kufic is also alive and well today and many fonts owe their design principles to it. On the other hand Latin is not always necessarily blocky and rigid- what about the fantastical swashbuckling quill-pen calligraphy of yore with spirals and curves sweeping all over the page? My objection is that the Matchmakers started out from the very start to create an Arabic font subservient to a given Latin. Why not the other way round? Perhaps it is a sort of 'political' objection after all. Arabs should have a bit more confidence, pride and respect - call it a love - for their traditions and make an effort to find their own style in this amazing multinational world of ours.

[Member Saa…]

Finedesign (Paul) wrote:

>>I know I’m going to say some ignorant things here, and you guys are going to set me in my place.

Permit me to call you Paul! What you said is quite eloquent and more mature than I have ever heard from most members of our Arabic Typography community.

>>Didn’t Arabic evolve from the Kufi script that was originally somewhat flat, rigid and rather “Latinesque?” (fixed/blocky) I know Kufi has many styles, but before Islam the Arabic script was very basic, yes? Eventually master calligraphers redefined the original Arabic into incredible art forms, but couldn’t it be said that they did this because they were playing with the language and redefining it?

Precisely. I think the earlier move to cursive forms and subsequently to the elaborate calligraphic forms was necessitated by many legitimate factors. In these old golden times, the main rule that was in effect was “open mindedness”; there were no “script rules”. In our typographic age, with many other factors playing, (typographic, political, religious, economic ... etc), we need to move on and stay away for any fixed design notion. I am actually finishing up new fonts for Jazm, the earliest Arabic script which is directly related to early Kufi, just to illustrate this point.

>> How is the Matchmaking project any different than what happened in the past?

I think the main problem of Matchmaking concept is that it “sucks up” (unnecessarily) to Latin! To start, I would re-iterate Vladimir and Behnam points, harmonizing two scripts is two way process. We do need to incorporate good typographic design concepts and ideas used in Latin (or other scripts) as good design concepts not as Latin design concepts; just as driving a car today in not “Westernization” or studying “Al-Jabr” (Algebra) is not “Arabization”. Typography is an independent field, re-using design concepts used for Latin, does not owe a “penny” to Latin, but to Typography. What bothers me the most about the Matchmaking is that young designers are sitting down to design Arabic fonts in general (not to fulfill a specific harmonizing project need) but having harmonizing with Latin as the main goal and drive. People around the world do not drive cars to match western civilization look, do they?

Secondly, despite the fact that anyone of us can learn from colleagues around the world, one must be careful not to give the impression that a well known Latin type designer can have any significant input for Arabic type design without being *significantly and sufficiently involved* in the field. Otherwise this would become just a “photo opportunity” to look good.

-Saad

[Member Saa…]

Vladimir

>>Since the mid-sixties the Arab press is favoring the use of Latinized Arab numerals 012345 (rather than the Indic numerals). The fonts often used for the numerals is awfully mismatched and jumps out of the line in a disturbing way.

This was actually a good phenomenon that went wrong because of laziness or perhaps due to that Matchmaking mentality. In all my fonts, I take time to redesign these numbers to match the Arabic text, in a clear bias decision.

>>The glory of Arabic script is the compact and curvatious lines and highly developed sense of the individuality of each letter-shape. It is written in a totally different spirit than Latin with its blocks of same-height letters and repeated forms.

This is true to some extent, but should not be taken to an extreme. We need to address, additionally, typography, without requiring blindly rules of calligraphy and handwritting. As Latin typography succeeded to do to some extend, Arabic typography should rid itself from that “anal typography” element within!

>>You are specially welcome here as it is good to hear the views of someone in a position to know much more about what is going on in the market and design community than any one of us as individuals.

The Arabetic font market needs wide options. Designers need to design, present, and let users decide. A market share of 1% for a font is as legitimate and important as 30%! No one should be in a position to deprive Arabic from this natural basic right.

>>It has now become technically possible to present scripts of any imaginable complexity by programming the software under the hood.

This is great news indeed, but it should not be used as call to “keep” intact complex scribing and calligraphy rules as rules of typography. As I wrote in one of my articles a “technology friendly font is a font independent of technology”. Technology changes and there is no final solution here. Arabic fonts should not be obstacle to technology, but an easy and light companion of it.

>>I am now newly aware how difficult it is to design a really good Latin font!

Actually I think designing good Arabic fonts is much easier than designing Latin fonts, even lousy Latin fonts.

-Saad

[Member fin…]

@Saad, you made it perfectly clear to me now. Thank you.

However, I must say that we are in uncharted times...globalization is causing us to think in new ways as to the balance between cultural identity and interconnectivity. A thousand years ago, did we need to "shoehorn" one script into another? Again, because of the times, I think it's inevitable.

For that reason, I think this Matchmaking trend COULD go the other way too! Why not "shoehorn" Latin into Arabic. That would be sweet. :)

I think the main fear is that "Americanization" (I'm from the US, by the way) is robbing the world of it's distinct people groups and cultures. Fair enough. I agree wholeheartedly. Yemen is special because it's so un-American (for the time being). But if it wasn't America, it would be somebody else. The fact is, we're all being squished together and we need ways to be interconnected. There is going to be some trade-off on all sides.

Looking at it another way, could we say the same thing about interracial marriages? (Boy, this is a dangerous opener!) Do we lament the fact that a dark-skinned and light-skinned couple has a baby that's brown? I'm not even saying it's wrong to dislike that. I like living in Yemen, where the distinctive features of the people immediately set me apart visually. Are we all going to be brown in 1000 years? I don't think so, because there will always be people who prefer their own race. (Like we will always have true Nasque fonts) And that makes me happy too. I know I'm not comparing apples to apples, but in an odd way I see a connection.

And forgive me for making the connection if I'm in error, but on your Arabetics site (www.arabetics.com), several of your fonts appear to be using Basic Arabic. Isn't that worse than Matchmaking? To disconnect individual letters in Arabic just doesn't make sense to me and is the epitome of "sucking up." (I don't mean this disrespectfully.)

My account says finedesign, but I included my true name in the registration form. By default, Drupal displays the username, not the actual name. But I thought Typophile folks changed this to show the actual name. Anyway, thanks for figuring out my real name.

@Vladimir
I knew I was going to be sorry for saying Latin was "fixed/blocky" since we all know there is a cursive script. But thank you for your feedback as well. I think I also responded to your comment in the above statements.

I really like this forum topic, though. I think the central question remains, "Just because I CAN do something, doesn't mean I SHOULD do it." That's why we're designers. We're hired to be discretionary.

with zahoor (you guys crack me up)

[Member Saa…]

Hello Paul,

Nice to chat with someone living in the heartland of Arabia!

>>A thousand years ago, did we need to “shoehorn” one script into another? Again, because of the times, I think it’s inevitable.

Actually Arabic Jazm was a clear adaptation of Musnad (the old Arabic script) to Aramaic and Hebraic scripts of the North. Script will forever interact due to real factors on the ground. But for interaction to be healthy and productive for all, it has to be interaction and melting and replacement.

>>To disconnect individual letters in Arabic just doesn’t make sense to me and is the epitome of “sucking up.” (I don’t mean this disrespectfully.)

Arabic Musnad (all over you in Yaman) had both isolated forms and cursive forms for centuries, and was bi-directional. Arabic Jazm, its derivative, started with mixed forms and ended very cursive for good reasons. Today, Latin has both too, it did not always. I am not sure why despite all facts, one must insist or even hint that Latin owns a monopoly or patent on the proccess of simplification, adaption and diversification? Why would designing isolated (or as I call them virtually connected) *fully Arabic* letter forms would be "sucking up" to Latin or any other script? If you can prove that Latin owns the right to isolated forms, I would be glad to give Latin the credit.

-Saad

[Member Saa…]

I meant to say:

But for interaction to be healthy and productive for all, it has to be interaction *not* melting and replacement.

[Member beh…]

What's the point of matchmaking anyway? If it's about making Arabic script look like Roman, I have a far better idea. Adopting Roman script altogether (which I was a supporter in my youth and still have nothing against it). This way at least you take advantage of superior functionality.
But if it's about making them look good side by side, then make them look good side by side! Looking good doesn't mean looking identical. It means looking harmonious, each script remaining true to its nature. This is what makes them looking good. Be flamboyant, minimalist, modern, whatever you want to be in design options, but put your art to each script for what they are. Two fundamentally different scripts.
Let's face it. This is a non issue for Roman users. They don't have to put an Arabic email address, an Arabic URL, and Arabic brand name or an Arabic technical term, two three five times in each paragraph. This is an Arabic issue. And it can only be resolved in an Arabic font.
And this IS the starting point. A font that wants to create harmony between these two scripts is an ARABIC font. The issue has nothing to do with the x height.
Design Arabic and Roman characters the way you want, minding visual harmony in thickness and magnification of both scripts, adjusting the line spacing for the Arabic part (and that's the key) and you are done... in any design option.

[Member Saa…]

Bahnam wrote

>>Adopting Roman script altogether (which I was a supporter in my youth and still have nothing against it). This way at least you take advantage of superior functionality.

In many occasions I wrote that the number one reason why I do what I do is that I am still living the nightmare of Kamal Ataturk despicable move always from the Arabic script. I can not even tolerate reading the proposal of Sa'eed Aqil for a Latin based Lebanese national font. Let me admit here: I live in paranoia when it come to hearing such thoughts loud, because I see the Ataturk threat is live and kicking, waiting for the right moment to attack.

It is was once said that the extreme right and left would eventually meet. The Otaman Turks exajurated Arabic typography to an extreme level, only to replace it all together overnight! I think The Persians are equally capable. Lets face, one should just look at what the Arabs did to their Language in the Basrah Gulf area!

-Saad